Fascinating and it may explain some of my life experiences. I wonder to what extent this applies to crowds having a shared experience — for instance sporting events or political rallies. Particularly the latter where there is a one-to-many relationship between the speaker and crowd.
I think it is probably key to understanding that. I also think that lots of what Jung called the power of archetypes can be conceptualised through what neuroscience knows today as bio-behavioural synchrony. Thank you for reading 🙏.
Hey Nick, how you are doing? Thank you for reading. I guess it's like every powerful 'too' - it has its dark and its light side. That's how I see it anyways. Take human sociality all together for instance. The same thing applies.
Ya totally. I think it demonstrates how easily polarizing every aspect of human psych can be. Especially when u look at the brain - it’s as tho psych tries to use it as evidence for adaptive & maladaptive indicators but it’s just a neutral blob lol 😝
I am in the UK however and especially lately all of the new therapy trends come essentially from the US. Therapists (practitioners) mean well, they hear the latest thing and facing day in day out people who are not well, they just want to help. And of course neurobabble brings an edge of ‘science’ - and to be fair - some neuroscience has been absolute gamechanger in therapy - but lots of merchants of dreams and snake oil salesmen about. It’s a tricky one for a therapist (with typically no science training let alone neuroscience) to separate the wheat from the chaff.
here in canada, and assumedly similar to the APA ethical codes, research and evidence is necessary to support ethical decision making when it comes to treatment, but it's often considered last. When u add a capitalist drive to privatize the industry, and increasing regulatory demands (ie u have to be supervised when u start out... and most often u have to pay for supervision at the same rate as therapy would cost... so Im about to drop another 20k on supervision after I'm done my school which was 40k. thankfully I did my neuro degree in berlin so it was free, but next ill have to get trained in bullshit "evidence-based" therapy like EMDR (not neuro proven btw) or bullshit polyvagal treatment (which is like front page in the APA magazines and psychology today haha) just to compete with my fellow practitioners so I can put it on my profile to attract clients with the latest trend of "evidentiary" treatment.... it's despicable how psychotherapy (or whatever u wanna call it) splits from what actual psychology is, IMO, to use things like neuroscience to benefit the rich...
how is the UK when it comes to privatization of therapy? I've heard the NHS is awful in its own ways, but considering the north American neoliberal push for private clinics etc., it's still a good alternative no?
Wouah. Grim prospect. The PVT on the cover page of APA magazine, is it? Would love to see that if you have a screenshot. To be fair, things are different here - to be a successful therapist in the UK you don't need to use any of the new stuff, there is lots of people (majority) who use the old school stuff such as just Rogerian approach or you know more psychodynamic stuff, or gestalt. I work in private practice myself so I would not really know how things are in the NHS quality wise, but the NHS in he UK is undergoing a major crisis (and might even implode) and very few people of those who need it get to see a therapist on the NHS. And even when it happens the treatment is pretty short. The waiting lists can literally be several years. On the bright side the cost of private therapy in the UK is less redhibitory and more affordable with many options to get reduced rate therapy too. Therefore people generally go for private therapy (although not necessarily reimbursed by anybody). Especially outside of London it is not a luxury as such, and I have many clients from the working class or even students. Good luck to you, and the fact that you have a neuro degree gives you a very special edge to use neuroscience but without falling for neurobollocks.
I often feel like psychotherapy imposes a "good" and "bad" in good faith to help those who are struggling, but I hate how they politicize and capitalize on neuro evidence as some kind of proof that specific methods are better than others in treatment to profit from training programs... anyways ... are u in Europe ? i wonder how the psychotherapy market is there?
Thank you for the insight. I realized, while reading the article, that I was in an extremely synchronous relationship on myriad aspects, with one exception… I could never really predict her state, and that eventually outweighed every single superlative I was experiencing as I bent and flexed to regain the alignment. When I could no longer regulate, due to feelings of vulnerability stemming from my own cancer recovery, our beautiful relationship came to an end. I continue to be sad about it, six months later, but articles like this help that little bit as I gain more understanding on being human.
Hi Terry. Thank you for reading 🙏. Yes, I think synchrony can also be treacherous like that - I think we might assume that because of the synchrony we feel we then can predict someone’s mental states and actions - and I think overwhelmingly that is true and certainly more true than without synchrony- yet people are complex and sometimes that prediction does not compute. Thank you so much for sharing your experience and I love to hear that what I put out creates some food for insight. 🙏
I am really curious about all of this and the science behind. I feel this way with my husband. We read each other's mind. We complete each other's sentences, and we always know when something is off. It's amazing, but very much intense.
It is! I've never felt so loved and understood. We laugh a lot and the sex is amazing! And it started shortly after we met. I actually wonder how a child might change this balance. I am a bit worried because we're such a perfect dyad.
Love that. Sex and bio-behavioural synchrony. I’d lie if I said question never crossed my mind. I would love to see some research on that - admittedly a bit tricky to assess! I think some people just due to their neurophysiological/psychological background just synchronise better (there is some research around that)
Fascinating and it may explain some of my life experiences. I wonder to what extent this applies to crowds having a shared experience — for instance sporting events or political rallies. Particularly the latter where there is a one-to-many relationship between the speaker and crowd.
I think it is probably key to understanding that. I also think that lots of what Jung called the power of archetypes can be conceptualised through what neuroscience knows today as bio-behavioural synchrony. Thank you for reading 🙏.
I appreciate how u consider both sides of the coin!!! 🌖
Hey Nick, how you are doing? Thank you for reading. I guess it's like every powerful 'too' - it has its dark and its light side. That's how I see it anyways. Take human sociality all together for instance. The same thing applies.
Ya totally. I think it demonstrates how easily polarizing every aspect of human psych can be. Especially when u look at the brain - it’s as tho psych tries to use it as evidence for adaptive & maladaptive indicators but it’s just a neutral blob lol 😝
I am in the UK however and especially lately all of the new therapy trends come essentially from the US. Therapists (practitioners) mean well, they hear the latest thing and facing day in day out people who are not well, they just want to help. And of course neurobabble brings an edge of ‘science’ - and to be fair - some neuroscience has been absolute gamechanger in therapy - but lots of merchants of dreams and snake oil salesmen about. It’s a tricky one for a therapist (with typically no science training let alone neuroscience) to separate the wheat from the chaff.
here in canada, and assumedly similar to the APA ethical codes, research and evidence is necessary to support ethical decision making when it comes to treatment, but it's often considered last. When u add a capitalist drive to privatize the industry, and increasing regulatory demands (ie u have to be supervised when u start out... and most often u have to pay for supervision at the same rate as therapy would cost... so Im about to drop another 20k on supervision after I'm done my school which was 40k. thankfully I did my neuro degree in berlin so it was free, but next ill have to get trained in bullshit "evidence-based" therapy like EMDR (not neuro proven btw) or bullshit polyvagal treatment (which is like front page in the APA magazines and psychology today haha) just to compete with my fellow practitioners so I can put it on my profile to attract clients with the latest trend of "evidentiary" treatment.... it's despicable how psychotherapy (or whatever u wanna call it) splits from what actual psychology is, IMO, to use things like neuroscience to benefit the rich...
how is the UK when it comes to privatization of therapy? I've heard the NHS is awful in its own ways, but considering the north American neoliberal push for private clinics etc., it's still a good alternative no?
Wouah. Grim prospect. The PVT on the cover page of APA magazine, is it? Would love to see that if you have a screenshot. To be fair, things are different here - to be a successful therapist in the UK you don't need to use any of the new stuff, there is lots of people (majority) who use the old school stuff such as just Rogerian approach or you know more psychodynamic stuff, or gestalt. I work in private practice myself so I would not really know how things are in the NHS quality wise, but the NHS in he UK is undergoing a major crisis (and might even implode) and very few people of those who need it get to see a therapist on the NHS. And even when it happens the treatment is pretty short. The waiting lists can literally be several years. On the bright side the cost of private therapy in the UK is less redhibitory and more affordable with many options to get reduced rate therapy too. Therefore people generally go for private therapy (although not necessarily reimbursed by anybody). Especially outside of London it is not a luxury as such, and I have many clients from the working class or even students. Good luck to you, and the fact that you have a neuro degree gives you a very special edge to use neuroscience but without falling for neurobollocks.
I often feel like psychotherapy imposes a "good" and "bad" in good faith to help those who are struggling, but I hate how they politicize and capitalize on neuro evidence as some kind of proof that specific methods are better than others in treatment to profit from training programs... anyways ... are u in Europe ? i wonder how the psychotherapy market is there?
Thank you for the insight. I realized, while reading the article, that I was in an extremely synchronous relationship on myriad aspects, with one exception… I could never really predict her state, and that eventually outweighed every single superlative I was experiencing as I bent and flexed to regain the alignment. When I could no longer regulate, due to feelings of vulnerability stemming from my own cancer recovery, our beautiful relationship came to an end. I continue to be sad about it, six months later, but articles like this help that little bit as I gain more understanding on being human.
Hi Terry. Thank you for reading 🙏. Yes, I think synchrony can also be treacherous like that - I think we might assume that because of the synchrony we feel we then can predict someone’s mental states and actions - and I think overwhelmingly that is true and certainly more true than without synchrony- yet people are complex and sometimes that prediction does not compute. Thank you so much for sharing your experience and I love to hear that what I put out creates some food for insight. 🙏
I am really curious about all of this and the science behind. I feel this way with my husband. We read each other's mind. We complete each other's sentences, and we always know when something is off. It's amazing, but very much intense.
Frederica, hey! It sounds like you are those synchrony junkies that I talk about in the piece! That sounds very nice (even if intense).
It is! I've never felt so loved and understood. We laugh a lot and the sex is amazing! And it started shortly after we met. I actually wonder how a child might change this balance. I am a bit worried because we're such a perfect dyad.
Love that. Sex and bio-behavioural synchrony. I’d lie if I said question never crossed my mind. I would love to see some research on that - admittedly a bit tricky to assess! I think some people just due to their neurophysiological/psychological background just synchronise better (there is some research around that)
and sounds like you have found a perfect match!